UK Defence Forum

R686 wrote: ↑06 Dec 2021, 09:57 Dam no like button yet

Just can't resist posting this. in regards to how UK manufacturing and investment would plummet after Brexit :-

https://twitter.com/hashtag/UKmfg?src=hashtag_click

Have the Irish lost the plot on what the actual Belfast agreement and Common Travel Area is and whom it applies to, for gods sake

Good on UK for protecting sits borders, good enough for the EU to protect the single market good enough for the UK as well



Do they not understand that it only applies to Irish/UK citizens

R686 wrote: ↑10 Dec 2021, 11:00 Have the Irish lost the plot on what the actual Belfast agreement and Common Travel Area is and whom it applies to, for gods sake

Good on UK for protecting sits borders, good enough for the EU to protect the single market good enough for the UK as well



Do they not understand that it only applies to Irish/UK citizens

That is because the Sinn Fein are shameless liars ... the terms of both the Belfast Agreement and CTA are legally clear - and the Sinn Fein has helped to violate the Belfast Agreement through the Northern Ireland Protocol..

As for "protecting the single market" - that shame is on the EU for attempting to say a trading area ( which is all it is ..) is more important that the terrotorial integrity, constitutional order of the UK is both shameful and disgusting and we all have Theresea May and the remoaners to blame for allowing us to walk away and instead being forced into that damn pickle..

Surely any serious post Brexit government would be doing their level best to avoid what is being proposed here? Paywall, but you get the gist.

Lord Frost Resigns

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-59714241

Brexit minister Lord Frost has resigned from Boris Johnson's government.

He led the UK's negotiations over the EU Withdrawal Agreement and Northern Ireland Protocol.
In a letter to Mr Johnson, Lord Frost said that while "Brexit is now secure" he had "concerns about the current direction of travel".

The Mail on Sunday, which first reported the news, said he handed in his resignation a week ago, partly in disagreement with Covid curbs.

In his letter, Lord Frost, who attended cabinet, said his resignation would take "immediate effect" and spoke of his desire to see a "low-tax" economy.

"I hope we will move as fast as possible to where we need to get to: a lightly regulated, low-tax, entrepreneurial economy, at the cutting edge of modern science and economic change," he said.

He added that measures to reopen the economy in July "did not prove to be irreversible" - adding: "I hope we can get back on track soon and not be tempted by the kind of coercive measures we have seen elsewhere."
Responding to Lord Frost, Mr Johnson said he should be "immensely proud of your historic service to this government and this country".

It comes after a week where the prime minister suffered a by-election defeat with the Conservatives losing the previously safe seat of North Shropshire - which the party had held for nearly two centuries - to the Liberal Democrats.

He also endured the biggest rebellion of his premiership so far when many of his own MPs voted against the government over the introduction of so-called Plan B curbs in England.

A total of 99 Conservatives voted against the government, but the measures - including Covid passes at larger venues - passed by a majority of 243 thanks to Labour support.

Lord Frost had most recently been engaged in negotiations with the EU over post-Brexit arrangements.
This included elements of the Northern Ireland Protocol, agreed by the UK and EU in 2019, that allows goods to cross the border between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland without checks.

The protocol has been criticised by some businesses for making it more difficult to send goods to Northern Ireland from Great Britain.

DUP leader Sir Jeffrey Donaldson said the resignation raised questions about the UK's approach to the Northern Ireland Protocol.

Sir Jeffrey said Mr Johnson "must now urgently decide which is more important - the Protocol or the stability of the political institutions".

Northern Ireland's deputy first minister, Sinn Fein's Michelle O'Neill, said momentum was needed in negotiations to make the Protocol work better.
"The North will not be collateral damage in the Tory chaos," she added.

zanahoria wrote: ↑19 Dec 2021, 00:54 Lord Frost Resigns

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-59714241

Brexit minister Lord Frost has resigned from Boris Johnson's government.

You can't really blame him. I wouldn't want to be left carrying the can when full customs controls come in to effect at the start of the year.

Pseudo wrote: ↑28 Dec 2021, 21:20

zanahoria wrote: ↑19 Dec 2021, 00:54 Lord Frost Resigns

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-59714241

Brexit minister Lord Frost has resigned from Boris Johnson's government.

You can't really blame him. I wouldn't want to be left carrying the can when full customs controls come in to effect at the start of the year.

Odd how he and his successor were previously pro EU.

Truss’s political journey seems to be one Damascene conversion after another, with each successive conversion yielding a commensurate increase in power, wealth and/or influence.

Never thought I’d see a headline like this in the Express:

'Unmitigated disaster' Boris' Brexit deal savaged as damning study shows UK firms reeling

BORIS JOHNSON'S Brexit deal has come under explosive attack after a damning study revealed more than two-thirds of UK businesses have been left reeling from the UK leaving the European Union.

Only eight percent of the 1,000 firms polled by the British Chamber of Commerce (BCC) agreed the Brexit Trade and Co-operation Agreement (TCA) signed with the European Union was "enabling their business to grow or increase sales". For UK exporters alone, just 12 percent agreed the trade deal was helping them, while more than two-thirds (71 percent) disagreed. When asked to comment on the specific advantage (for those that agreed) or disadvantage (for those that disagreed) of the trade deal, 320 cited a disadvantage.

These included the trade deal leading to rising costs for companies and their clients, and smaller firms not having enough time and money to deal with the bureaucracy it had introduced.

Rest of article:

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics ... ts-exports

For every 1 article the Express publishes saying Brexit is a disaster - there is 1 article saying it is fantastic and we are sticking it to the EU and the future is wonderful... sometimes on the same day on the same home page. The truth is somewhere in between. They have a Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde to everything ......

Oh is the express trying to get us back in the EU now I wonder ?

zanahoria wrote: ↑19 Feb 2022, 06:09 Never thought I’d see a headline like this in the Express:

'Unmitigated disaster' Boris' Brexit deal savaged as damning study shows UK firms reeling

BORIS JOHNSON'S Brexit deal has come under explosive attack after a damning study revealed more than two-thirds of UK businesses have been left reeling from the UK leaving the European Union.

Only eight percent of the 1,000 firms polled by the British Chamber of Commerce (BCC) agreed the Brexit Trade and Co-operation Agreement (TCA) signed with the European Union was "enabling their business to grow or increase sales". For UK exporters alone, just 12 percent agreed the trade deal was helping them, while more than two-thirds (71 percent) disagreed. When asked to comment on the specific advantage (for those that agreed) or disadvantage (for those that disagreed) of the trade deal, 320 cited a disadvantage.

These included the trade deal leading to rising costs for companies and their clients, and smaller firms not having enough time and money to deal with the bureaucracy it had introduced.

Rest of article:

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics ... ts-exports

Gee not really sure why businesses thought it was going to be more of the same, of course there was going to be friction at the border. You cannot be independent and sovereign without some sort of template at the border just like there has to be checks on goods arriving from other third nations unless you have made arrangements for mutual recognition. But really do not understand why you are just giving them a free ride at the border without reciprocal arrangements is beyond me

If you wanted independence but still have access under the same conditions then they should not have voted for it. You are either in or out and I think you are better of out overall.

This is one of those threads I am not going to come back to; just to summarise what I have said over many years:

Suffer, baby, suffer. And then suffer some more.
- not all, of course. But the vast majority.

ArmChairCivvy wrote: ↑19 Feb 2022, 22:57 This is one of those threads I am not going to come back to; just to summarise what I have said over many years:

Suffer, baby, suffer. And then suffer some more.
- not all, of course. But the vast majority.

And that’s is why the nation is where it is, sour grapes

Don’t understand this why do you want the nation to suffer, the electorate made the decision you should be supporting the nation to get the best deal and get ahead as that is what the nation decided

R686 wrote: ↑19 Feb 2022, 23:23
And that’s is why the nation is where it is, sour grapes

Don’t understand this why do you want the nation to suffer, the electorate made the decision you should be supporting the nation to get the best deal and get ahead as that is what the nation decided

It's not sour grapes, more just desserts.

This is what happens when Brexiteers treat democracy as a competition and remoaners are demonised for saying politicians might be fibbing about just how easy this will be. All the BS about 'oven ready' deals and the EU will be begging us for a deal, 'we hold all the cards' and all that crap.

We voted for Brexit and it's happening, great stuff, democracy in action. I won't shed a tear when the electorate gets what it voted for.

Brexit limits trade with Europe in the short term - shock horror… not. The test of Brexit though isn’t the short term it’s the first 10-20 years, and will depend largely on whether the UK makes use of the agility in trade and policy making that it didn’t have whilst in the EU.

Remainers will remain sore about the decision. They will look for every negative and use it to prove they were right - human nature of heuristics and biases dictates it. The challenge however is now with those that voted Brexit to ultimately prove them wrong.

Defiance wrote: ↑20 Feb 2022, 08:11

R686 wrote: ↑19 Feb 2022, 23:23
And that’s is why the nation is where it is, sour grapes

Don’t understand this why do you want the nation to suffer, the electorate made the decision you should be supporting the nation to get the best deal and get ahead as that is what the nation decided

It's not sour grapes, more just desserts.

This is what happens when Brexiteers treat democracy as a competition and remoaners are demonised for saying politicians might be fibbing about just how easy this will be. All the BS about 'oven ready' deals and the EU will be begging us for a deal, 'we hold all the cards' and all that crap.

We voted for Brexit and it's happening, great stuff, democracy in action. I won't shed a tear when the electorate gets what it voted for.

Interesting that you want to condense it down to a few sound bites, but the basic tenant of democracy is that the losing side to accept the outcome.

And I will say it again the only reason that you the UK are in this position is the very fact that remaindid all in its power to stop the UK from leaving and it’s those reasons that the UK is in the position it is in now. All the problems can be held at the feet of remainers

I’ve never heard of a board of directors tell it’s negotiators in company dealing that they have to get a deal no matter if it’s is good for the company or not, Parliament in this case were the board of directors the Benn Act was the most treasonous Act of self inflicted harm I’ve ever seen

There was nothing in A50 that said you had to have a withdrawal agreement, if you think that the EU would not have negotiated after the fact you are mistaken. Only thing the EU wanted to do was protect its trade surplus at the detriment to other third nations

Ducking out of this thread, politics is always best avoided. Let the Brexit wins keep on coming plz.

Brexiters are pawns in Putin's game.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundatio ... eopolitics

sunstersun wrote: ↑28 Feb 2022, 02:49 Brexiters are pawns in Putin's game.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundatio ... eopolitics

How do you come to that conclusion?

Geez it must be tiring for the UK residents and the media what ever goes wrong it’s the fault of Brexit


https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp.the ... oyment-law

I’m just waiting for them to say climate change is the fault of Brexit

Boris Johnson compares Ukraine to Brits 'wanting to be free' by choosing Brexit in conference speech

TSharpe28 wrote: ↑20 Mar 2022, 07:43

Boris Johnson compares Ukraine to Brits 'wanting to be free' by choosing Brexit in conference speech

Not doing himself any favours there

Hopefully there will be some increase in trade & prosperity at some stage after Brexit, otherwise defence spending, amongst other things, will take an even bigger hit than usual.

From the FT:

Brexit blamed as UK misses out on global trade rebound

Britain’s 14 per cent fall in goods exports stands in contrast to 8.2 per cent rise for rest of world.

Rest of article:

https://on.ft.com/3iBkWMv

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/news/ ... en-317591/

Reactions as latest UK trade figures outline how catastrophic Brexit has been

"As every single serious economist argued, massively raising barriers with your main trade partner is an extraordinary act of self-harm."