Conservative party

For discussions on politics and current events.
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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Ohh, no... just as I was feeling for Boris, being locked up while there was important stuff to attend to,
well, may be that led to this:
"you can trust Sky News

A row has erupted after Boris Johnson reportedly condemned devolution in Scotland, saying it had been "a disaster north of the border".

The prime minister claimed it was Tony Blair's "biggest mistake" and that while he previously thought it was a good idea, he could not "see a case" for handing down more powers to Holyrood, according to The Sun.

Downing Street did not deny the remarks were made at a virtual meeting with northern Tory MPs"

The mention of The Sun makes this a bit iffy, but carrying on, this way, will actually make for a border. And Scotland being to the North of it
... isn't one in the Irish Sea bad enough, already?
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

zanahoria
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Re: Conservative party

Post by zanahoria »

Is it too much to hope for the prompt arrival of some serious politicians in possession of intelligence, probity and strategic thinking - all ensconced & carried along by an unswerving belief in public service to the United Kingdom?

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Plenty of time to reflect
"A report into allegations Home Secretary Priti Patel bullied staff is "with" the prime minister, a former head of the civil service has said.

Sir Mark Sedwill said Boris Johnson "needs to reflect and make a decision" following a fact-finding review led by a senior civil servant."
assuming the recent rumours of a reshuffle in Feb are accurate.
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

zanahoria
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Re: Conservative party

Post by zanahoria »

Just in case anyone is wondering why there isn’t enough cash to fund defence programs over the next few years.


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Cooper
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Re: Conservative party

Post by Cooper »

zanahoria wrote:Just in case anyone is wondering why there isn’t enough cash to fund defence programs over the next few years.

You're quoting that utter fucking remoaner loon, as your source?

You fail.

bobp
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Re: Conservative party

Post by bobp »

zanahoria wrote:Just in case anyone is wondering why there isn’t enough cash to fund defence programs over the next few years.
You are wrong big announcement tomorrow regarding Defence.

zanahoria
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Re: Conservative party

Post by zanahoria »

bobp wrote:wrong big announcement tomorrow regarding Defence.

Go in, give us a hint!

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RichardIC
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Re: Conservative party

Post by RichardIC »

zanahoria wrote:Go in, give us a hint!
Link posted on the future escort thread from The Times - and it's not behind a paywall. Four year settlement with an extra £14.5 billion predicted. Possibly not enough to fill the black hole but gives more certainty and should allow key programmes to progress.

Announcement expected in the Commons tomorrow.

zanahoria
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Re: Conservative party

Post by zanahoria »

Cooper wrote:
zanahoria wrote:Just in case anyone is wondering why there isn’t enough cash to fund defence programs over the next few years.

You're quoting that utter fucking remoaner loon, as your source?

You fail.
Speaking of “fail”, the not-very-left-wing-and-not-exactly-remoaner Daily Mail is running with it:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ssion=true

zanahoria
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Re: Conservative party

Post by zanahoria »

RichardIC wrote:
zanahoria wrote:Go in, give us a hint!
Link posted on the future escort thread from The Times - and it's not behind a paywall. Four year settlement with an extra £14.5 billion predicted. Possibly not enough to fill the black hole but gives more certainty and should allow key programmes to progress.

Announcement expected in the Commons tomorrow.

Thank you!

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Ethics and propriety defenestered
... culprit sitting pretty (in the ministerial post; despite what ministerial code says; and the independent process put in place to back it, rather than being just words.)
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

zanahoria
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Re: Conservative party

Post by zanahoria »

ArmChairCivvy wrote:Ethics and propriety defenestered
... culprit sitting pretty (in the ministerial post; despite what ministerial code says; and the independent process put in place to back it, rather than being just words.)
It is extremely worrying, but not surprising.

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

As we learn through major news 'outlets'

"Downing Street has not denied reports that Mr Johnson tried to influence the report's findings, with a spokesman instead saying: "As you would expect, the prime minister spoke to Sir Alex Allan to further his understanding of the report."["]

When Sir Alex didn't understand what he had written, the PM - offering a helping hand - wrote his own interpretation.
- it must have been quite a few versions, having taken this long
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Boris & close circle boxed in from three sides: ERG on the right, CRG on the 'left' and backbenchers (murmuring about the lacking quality in Cabinet decision making) poised 'behind' him
... and this has not gone unnoticed by the opposition; they have shifted the target of their rolling artillery fire to
"The Chancellor [who] has not yet commented and hasn’t appeared in Parliament for nearly three weeks.

Ms Dodds said: "This last-minute announcement will have plunged many businesses into chaos. Yet in these difficult times the Chancellor is nowhere to be seen.

“Rishi Sunak was happy to put his name all over government policy when it suited him, but now he’s totally absent. He must come out of hiding and give workers and businesses the certainty and support they deserve."["]
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Did anyone get to pick up a copy, under the Xmas tree?

Boris Johnson: The Gambler
By Tom Bower
Reviewed By Andrew Moravcsik, then abridged ('capsule') for Foreign Affairs
January/February 2021


In today’s media-obsessed world, many politicians publicly flaunt narcissistic personal habits, lie openly about important issues, shift their fundamental principles to fit the moment, tailor their actions to build a personal brand rather than a political legacy, and hire subordinates more for loyalty than expertise. This book illustrates these trends by tracing the life of British Prime Minister Boris Johnson [and ...] is the newest recounting of the prime minister’s life, taking the reader all the way up through July 2020—well into the COVID-19 pandemic.
[...]
Johnson emerges as the stereotypical rich boy from a privileged background. He is a compulsive gambler who repeatedly jeopardizes his jobs, marriages, and future prospects through sloppy, lazy, and risky behavior—and each time is saved by his charm, luck, ambition, and connections.
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Some folks expressed a dislike for polls when I brought up their value as a gauge for longer trending.

Well, this one does not have much value as GE is so far away, but looking back (at that time, or even before) it could turn out to be a marker for... a turning ;) point:

" the first detailed survey of the public’s perception of Johnson’s handling of the recently concluded Brexit talks and the COVID-19 pandemic after he reversed plans to allow families to meet up at Christmas in parts of southern England to combat the spread of the virus.

More than 22,000 people were surveyed in a closely watched poll constituency-by-constituency poll over a four-week period in December, which was conducted by the research data company Focaldata and published by the Sunday Times.

The so-called multilevel regression and post-stratification (MRP) poll found the ruling Conservatives would lose 81 seats, wiping out the 80-seat majority. This would leave the Conservatives with 284 seats, while the opposition Labour Party would win 282 seats, the poll showed.

The Scottish National Party, which wants to break away from the rest of the United Kingdom, is predicted to win 57 of the 59 seats in Scotland, meaning the party could potentially play a kingmaker role in forming the next government.

The prime minister is at risk to lose his own seat of Uxbridge, west of London, the poll found."
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-brita ... KKBN2970M9

I can understand why Raab recently said the Gvmnt will now turn its focus to strengthening the Union (that was quick on the heels :) of Boris talking about 'the catastrophe').
- a Gvmnt with two ex-journos at its head is good at talking, but of not much use in doing (governing). Who puts in the seeds, he will reap the yield :?:
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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Pseudo
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Re: Conservative party

Post by Pseudo »

ArmChairCivvy wrote:Some folks expressed a dislike for polls when I brought up their value as a gauge for longer trending.

Well, this one does not have much value as GE is so far away, but looking back (at that time, or even before) it could turn out to be a marker for... a turning ;) point:

" the first detailed survey of the public’s perception of Johnson’s handling of the recently concluded Brexit talks and the COVID-19 pandemic after he reversed plans to allow families to meet up at Christmas in parts of southern England to combat the spread of the virus.

More than 22,000 people were surveyed in a closely watched poll constituency-by-constituency poll over a four-week period in December, which was conducted by the research data company Focaldata and published by the Sunday Times.

The so-called multilevel regression and post-stratification (MRP) poll found the ruling Conservatives would lose 81 seats, wiping out the 80-seat majority. This would leave the Conservatives with 284 seats, while the opposition Labour Party would win 282 seats, the poll showed.

The Scottish National Party, which wants to break away from the rest of the United Kingdom, is predicted to win 57 of the 59 seats in Scotland, meaning the party could potentially play a kingmaker role in forming the next government.

The prime minister is at risk to lose his own seat of Uxbridge, west of London, the poll found."
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-brita ... KKBN2970M9

I can understand why Raab recently said the Gvmnt will now turn its focus to strengthening the Union (that was quick on the heels :) of Boris talking about 'the catastrophe').
- a Gvmnt with two ex-journos at its head is good at talking, but of not much use in doing (governing). Who puts in the seeds, he will reap the yield :?:
Johnson got absolutely mauled by Andrew Marr this morning. Marr's usually a bit of a pussy cat but you know that it's a good interview when the PM is practically begging to go in to extra time to explain himself.

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Pseudo wrote:Johnson got absolutely mauled by Andrew Marr this morning
While I am sure that Boris and I would go into extra time (lots to talk about) if we accidentally met in a pub, I miss out on all of these 'remote' conversations... by not watching TV
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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Pseudo
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Re: Conservative party

Post by Pseudo »

ArmChairCivvy wrote:
Pseudo wrote:Johnson got absolutely mauled by Andrew Marr this morning
While I am sure that Boris and I would go into extra time (lots to talk about) if we accidentally met in a pub, I miss out on all of these 'remote' conversations... by not watching TV
Oh, you should give it a try. I'd definitely recommend Warship and Sandbaggers. :D

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

OK, howabout this one:

"Former Labour prime minister Tony Blair said [...]
"We had a referendum that rejected Scottish independence, but [1] Brexit put it back on the agenda again. And it's [2] going to require very careful management. The [3]truth of the matter is it's still not in Scotland's interest to separate from England.

"[4]There are huge economic and political reasons for the United Kingdom to stay the United Kingdom"

1. Yes
2. Only the party (if a one-party Gvmnt) that is on Gvmnt can do it (Ref: Raab has said it... but does that count for anything?)
3. True :)
4. Will that 'compute' this time around? Every day is a school day and somebody counted over 1660 of them for this exercising 'run' just done
... what does @D think :lol: ?
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Sir Desmond Swayne is escaping any disciplinary measures (I hear)
- but that is not the point

The point is that this is a diversion, so that those who themselves should be facing disciplinary measures, can get on their high horse, and thus their case be forgotten about in this whirlwind

Not saying "it" was planned, but serves a purpose, nevertheless

Ehmm, ministerial code. Is there a new impartial arbitrator for that one in place again, by now :?:
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Looks like the Conservative Party (ehmm, let's not forget about the Union) is finally doing something to conserve - rather than destroy:

"Ministers will fine universities which stifle freedom of speech and tell heritage groups "public funds must never be used for political purposes" in a major new bid to torpedo efforts at rewriting Britain's history"
- assuming the header from The Sunday Telegraph is accurate, that is
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Ehmm, ministerial code. Is there a new impartial arbitrator for that one in place again, by now
Or is such 'window dressing' unnecessary, overall? Compare with a BBC headline from 3 hrs ago:

"The High Court must overturn Boris Johnson's decision that Home Secretary Priti Patel did not breach government rules on behaviour, a union says.

The prime minister decided not to sack Ms Patel last year after a report found evidence of "bullying" and "some occasions of shouting and swearing".["]

Or, is there a subgroup of people who can do anything... and get away with it?
- or, perhaps... be sacked twice (Trump must be the teflon role model for not facing any such fate)
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

Have I missed the latest; is the case now shut & closed?
"Labour’s wider campaign on Tory waste of taxpayers’ cash. How can you turn down a decent pay reward for frontline staff at the same time as [....] paying out Priti Patel’s bullying settlement of £370,000? "
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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ArmChairCivvy
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Re: Conservative party

Post by ArmChairCivvy »

C'ed from the above (Looks like The Guardian had it on their front page):

340k to Rutnam (not from Priti; from you and me)
- still 34x more than what the punters were saying

30k towards legal costs
- would expect the Gvmnt side to have reached 6 figures on their side... we pay, again

So Priti goes Scotch free (bullying in three different Depts now on record... fired from only one - and not for that reason)
+ the PM retains the right (by paying out these monies) to rescue whoever else breaches the ministerial code
- the article is unclear as to whether the related action by the FDA will be continued, to secure clarity for the future

Let's see if the Mother of All Parliaments has any teeth in this
- court case avoided (save? for the one by the FDA)
- no evidence by the involved minister nor the PM in the tribunal (case settled)
=> will the senior civil servants still be able to 'speak freely' and give best advice?
Ever-lasting truths: Multi-year budgets/ planning by necessity have to address the painful questions; more often than not the Either-Or prevails over Both-And.
If everyone is thinking the same, then someone is not thinking (attributed to Patton)

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