NEDERLANDS

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lordroel
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Re: NEDERLANDS

Post by lordroel »

Using Google translate:

Netherlands Defense is augmenting firepower with rocket artillery and long-range weapons

The Netherlands Defense is strengthening the firepower of the armed forces. This is done with the purchase of rocket artillery for the army and long-range weapons for the navy and air force. These systems can target targets with great precision and power over longer distances. This is what State Secretary Christophe van der Maat writes to the House of Representatives today.

Rocket artillery allows army units to take out enemy targets with precision. This includes air defense and fire support systems, headquarters and logistics hubs. With long-range weapons, naval ships are able to take out targets in an opponent's backcountry. At present, Dutch naval vessels do not have armaments that are powerful enough and reach far enough to disable bunkers, for example.

The Netherlands does not have such capabilities from the air either. The F-35 has armament for combating ground targets that are relatively close. However, the F-35 cannot attack targets far in the hinterland of an opponent if they have a strong air defense. This requires armament with a long range. They are therefore equipped with long-range armament.

Van der Maat: “The war in Ukraine shows once again that fire support over short, medium and long range is essential. This applies on land, from the air and from the sea. With the new systems, the Ministry of Defense further substantiates NATO's common combat power and deterrence. This shows that the Netherlands is taking responsibility by making a strong contribution to this. In addition, the Netherlands thus meets the wish to possess its own rocket artillery and long-range weapon, as described in the Defense Policy Document 2022.”

PULS

The army will have access to the Israeli PULS (Precise and Universal Launch System) system this year. As a result, Defense has its own rocket artillery for the first time in years. This is necessary for effective ground-based fire support, because it reaches further, has larger payloads and can reach its target faster than current fire support means. The Dutch fire support currently has armored howitzers that can shoot up to 50 kilometers away.

The research phase for the system showed that there are 2 systems that meet the Dutch requirements: the HIMARS system and the PULS system. The PULS system distinguishes itself in various areas. Compared to the American HIMARS system, it can carry more missiles. It is also possible to purchase more rockets with the budget and they are available sooner. In addition, PULS will be suitable for ammunition from European manufacturers in the future.

A partner such as Denmark is also purchasing the PULS system, while Germany is interested. This offers prospects for international cooperation in order to increase European autonomy.

TOMAHAWK

American Tomahawk long-range weapons have been chosen for the Navy's LC frigates and submarines. This weapon can be launched from an air defense and commado frigate (LC frigate) as well as a submarine. It has a range of more than 1,000 kilometers. After launch, the user can direct the Tomahawk to follow a different route to the target or assign a different target. The American and British navies, among others, use the Tomahawk.

JASSM-ER

American-made armaments have also been chosen for the F-35. It concerns the JASSM-ER (Joint Air-to-Surface Standoff Missile-Extended Range). This weapon also has a range of about 1,000 kilometers. The US and Australian air forces are already using it. In Europe, Germany, Finland and Poland are also purchasing the JASSM-ER.

The naval and air force weapons have stealth capabilities, precision guidance and a suitable explosive charge to take out well-protected targets. By purchasing these kinds of weapons for the LC frigates, the submarines and the F-35s, the Netherlands will have the flexibility and strength needed to be successful during deployment.

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Re: NEDERLANDS

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HNLMS Vlissingen (M840) - The Netherlands' new MCM Mothership launched by Naval Group
Naval Group ceremonially launched the first mine countermeasure mothership for the Royal Netherlands Navy. HNLMS Vlissingen is the second of twelve mine countermeasure vessels in the Belgian-Dutch rMCM program.
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Re: NEDERLANDS

Post by Repulse »

1.1bn Euro for six - the price of three T31s. Extend another 10m and buy 12 for the RN to replace the OPVs and LSV / T32 mothership requirements.
”We have no eternal allies, and we have no perpetual enemies. Our interests are eternal and perpetual, and those interests it is our duty to follow." - Lord Palmerston

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Re: NEDERLANDS

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License building 6 for the RN as replacements for the hunt and river vessels would be a good way to go.
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Re: NEDERLANDS

Post by new guy »

The RN probably wants bigger; The equipment deck on these is only 2 boats and adjacent equipment, meanwhile apparently the RN wants 3 boats per unit, not even to mention ARCIMS. Hence getting OSV's with very large work decks.

100m babcock Cybele 90m MCMV vessel design?
90m BMT venator?
Black swan MHPC?
Recommissioned echo's?

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Re: NEDERLANDS

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SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 18:20 License building 6 for the RN as replacements for the hunt and river vessels would be a good way to go.
Would like more than six (would also eventually replace the B2 Rivers) and another 10m for sea keeping / more accommodation, but yes, small mods to an existing design.
”We have no eternal allies, and we have no perpetual enemies. Our interests are eternal and perpetual, and those interests it is our duty to follow." - Lord Palmerston

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Re: NEDERLANDS

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new guy wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 18:41
All options and the Venator 90m was a particular favourite of mine, but no a proven design given to Babcock after the T31 run - keep it simple.
”We have no eternal allies, and we have no perpetual enemies. Our interests are eternal and perpetual, and those interests it is our duty to follow." - Lord Palmerston

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Re: NEDERLANDS

Post by SW1 »

Repulse wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:48
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 18:20 License building 6 for the RN as replacements for the hunt and river vessels would be a good way to go.
Would like more than six (would also eventually replace the B2 Rivers) and another 10m for sea keeping / more accommodation, but yes, small mods to an existing design.
Type 31 will the replace the river 2

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Re: NEDERLANDS

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SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:53
Repulse wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:48
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 18:20 License building 6 for the RN as replacements for the hunt and river vessels would be a good way to go.
Would like more than six (would also eventually replace the B2 Rivers) and another 10m for sea keeping / more accommodation, but yes, small mods to an existing design.
Type 31 will the replace the river 2
Lets agree to disagree there :D
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Re: NEDERLANDS

Post by new guy »

Repulse wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:50
new guy wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 18:41
All options and the Venator 90m was a particular favourite of mine, but no a proven design given to Babcock after the T31 run - keep it simple.
Venator 90 without STANFLEX would be good; The RN won't buy it if it is the city class is my bet.

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Re: NEDERLANDS

Post by wargame_insomniac »

SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:53
Repulse wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:48
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 18:20 License building 6 for the RN as replacements for the hunt and river vessels would be a good way to go.
Would like more than six (would also eventually replace the B2 Rivers) and another 10m for sea keeping / more accommodation, but yes, small mods to an existing design.
Type 31 will the replace the river 2
No.....

5*T31 GP Frigates to replace 5*T23 GP Frigates!!
Simple. Not sure how you find that so confusing.

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Re: NEDERLANDS

Post by SW1 »

wargame_insomniac wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 21:45
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:53
Repulse wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:48
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 18:20 License building 6 for the RN as replacements for the hunt and river vessels would be a good way to go.
Would like more than six (would also eventually replace the B2 Rivers) and another 10m for sea keeping / more accommodation, but yes, small mods to an existing design.
Type 31 will the replace the river 2
No.....

5*T31 GP Frigates to replace 5*T23 GP Frigates!!
Simple. Not sure how you find that so confusing.
Because the river 2 are currently covering tasking for the type 23 gps that are materially in poor state and either scrapped already or in refit.

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Re: NEDERLANDS

Post by Repulse »

SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 22:14
wargame_insomniac wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 21:45
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:53
Repulse wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:48
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 18:20 License building 6 for the RN as replacements for the hunt and river vessels would be a good way to go.
Would like more than six (would also eventually replace the B2 Rivers) and another 10m for sea keeping / more accommodation, but yes, small mods to an existing design.
Type 31 will the replace the river 2
No.....

5*T31 GP Frigates to replace 5*T23 GP Frigates!!
Simple. Not sure how you find that so confusing.
Because the river 2 are currently covering tasking for the type 23 gps that are materially in poor state and either scrapped already or in refit.
Rubbish - if we must let’s go through this then let’s.

Currently, the Royal Navy has 3 remaining GP frigates, HMS Argyll is in refit, HMS Lancaster is supporting Op Kipion and HMS Iron Duke who which is in Norway. None of these are B2 commitments and will need to be covered by warships going forwards.

Three or the five B2 Rivers are currently based in Falklands, Caribbean and Gibraltar - none of these have a frigate deployed as a guard ship for decades. You could argue HMS Dauntless, but that would not be in the Caribbean if POW wasn’t. The two other B2 Rivers have been operating in the IndoPacific region, again doing things that the RN hasn’t done for decades.

Let’s cut the nonsense that the B2 Rivers will be replaced by the T31 - they could, but all the things that the five T23 did / are doing wouldn’t get done.
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Re: NEDERLANDS

Post by SW1 »

Repulse wrote: 22 Oct 2023, 10:18
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 22:14
wargame_insomniac wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 21:45
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:53
Repulse wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:48
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 18:20 License building 6 for the RN as replacements for the hunt and river vessels would be a good way to go.
Would like more than six (would also eventually replace the B2 Rivers) and another 10m for sea keeping / more accommodation, but yes, small mods to an existing design.
Type 31 will the replace the river 2
No.....

5*T31 GP Frigates to replace 5*T23 GP Frigates!!
Simple. Not sure how you find that so confusing.
Because the river 2 are currently covering tasking for the type 23 gps that are materially in poor state and either scrapped already or in refit.
Rubbish - if we must let’s go through this then let’s.

Currently, the Royal Navy has 3 remaining GP frigates, HMS Argyll is in refit, HMS Lancaster is supporting Op Kipion and HMS Iron Duke who which is in Norway. None of these are B2 commitments and will need to be covered by warships going forwards.

Three or the five B2 Rivers are currently based in Falklands, Caribbean and Gibraltar - none of these have a frigate deployed as a guard ship for decades. You could argue HMS Dauntless, but that would not be in the Caribbean if POW wasn’t. The two other B2 Rivers have been operating in the IndoPacific region, again doing things that the RN hasn’t done for decades.

Let’s cut the nonsense that the B2 Rivers will be replaced by the T31 - they could, but all the things that the five T23 did / are doing wouldn’t get done.
You can tell that to RN then it’s there plan.

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Re: NEDERLANDS

Post by Tempest414 »

Repulse wrote: 22 Oct 2023, 10:18
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 22:14
wargame_insomniac wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 21:45
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:53
Repulse wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 19:48
SW1 wrote: 21 Oct 2023, 18:20 License building 6 for the RN as replacements for the hunt and river vessels would be a good way to go.
Would like more than six (would also eventually replace the B2 Rivers) and another 10m for sea keeping / more accommodation, but yes, small mods to an existing design.
Type 31 will the replace the river 2
No.....

5*T31 GP Frigates to replace 5*T23 GP Frigates!!
Simple. Not sure how you find that so confusing.
Because the river 2 are currently covering tasking for the type 23 gps that are materially in poor state and either scrapped already or in refit.
Rubbish - if we must let’s go through this then let’s.

Currently, the Royal Navy has 3 remaining GP frigates, HMS Argyll is in refit, HMS Lancaster is supporting Op Kipion and HMS Iron Duke who which is in Norway. None of these are B2 commitments and will need to be covered by warships going forwards.

Three or the five B2 Rivers are currently based in Falklands, Caribbean and Gibraltar - none of these have a frigate deployed as a guard ship for decades. You could argue HMS Dauntless, but that would not be in the Caribbean if POW wasn’t. The two other B2 Rivers have been operating in the IndoPacific region, again doing things that the RN hasn’t done for decades.

Let’s cut the nonsense that the B2 Rivers will be replaced by the T31 - they could, but all the things that the five T23 did / are doing wouldn’t get done.
I think I will move to the C&F Escort thread

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Re: NEDERLANDS

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(sponsored video) Naval Group's pitch for the Walrus-class submarine replacement program:

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Re: NEDERLANDS

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Saab and Damen booth at NEDS 2023

00:31 - C71 expeditionary submarine
04:10 - ASWF
07:06 - F126 Frigate
08:41 - LPX for Dutch-British amphibious requirement
09:59 - Portuguese Navy "NRP D. João II" Multipurpose Vessel 10720

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Re: NEDERLANDS

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Admiral Tas on the present and future of the Royal Netherlands Navy

Interview with Vice Admiral René Tas, Commander of the Royal Netherlands Navy (Koninklijke Marine), during Indo Pacific 2023 in Sydney, Australia.

Admiral Tas introduces the Royal Netherlands Navy, comments the current threats and challenges that his navy is facing today. He then goes over the modernization and renewal of the dutch fleet. Lastly he announces an upcoming frigate deployment to the Indo Pacific region.

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Re: NEDERLANDS

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Re: NEDERLANDS

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The Netherlands go French with their new boats.
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