Is Russia paying us back of the 1980s?

[Lord Jim]

Just been wondering, it is often said that the US Star Wars Programme and other high tech projects of the 1980s were there partly to force the USSR to try to compete at a level it could not afford with regards to defence expenditure. Is Putin now doing this to NATO, showing off more and more new kit that seems to be superior or at least matching NATOs, causing panic in Governments and additional spending that NATO members cannot really afford and that will cause the respective governments headaches in up coming elections etc.

[ArmChairCivvy]

US Star Wars Programme and other high tech projects of the 1980s were there partly to force the USSR to try to compete at a level it could not afford

As for starters, nukes (maintaining, manning and renewing not just them but also the platforms) take a third of Russian defence budget. Wasnt it Trump who just days ago said "let us have a race" as it seems to have been started (by others) already.

That would be v unfortunate. But Putin parading shiny new kit is partly a Patjomkin facade - look behind it, at the actual volumes produced.
- the PAK-FA that was meant to make the rest of the world tremble has been cut to *one* operational sqdrn target (further orders so far out that they are not in any published plans)

Personally I think we are headed for a thaw, and Putins main goal has been to demonstrate that after the biggest Soviet-kit equipped army outside the nuclear club (Iraq) was taken down in a matter of days (and even Cheznya required a rematch)...
the Russian ability to intervene (and defend) should be taken for real

A v worrying trend in his near-abroad, but on the world scene just seeking recognition. Must say that him having played the very bad hand so well raises questions about political leadership (and strategic analysis) elsewhere.
- a shrinking economy has to be turned around , though . Otherwise the next elections could turn to real ones.

[abc123]

Just been wondering, it is often said that the US Star Wars Programme and other high tech projects of the 1980s were there partly to force the USSR to try to compete at a level it could not afford with regards to defence expenditure. Is Putin now doing this to NATO, showing off more and more new kit that seems to be superior or at least matching NATOs, causing panic in Governments and additional spending that NATO members cannot really afford and that will cause the respective governments headaches in up coming elections etc.

Cannot or don't want?

[seaspear]

It might be that Putin who views the break up of the Soviet union as a tragedy the same way Hitler viewed the the terms of Versailles ,Hitler went all out to regain for Germany lost territority .
If there there have been any restriction on some of the Russian defense programs it may be as a result of the oil price and economic sanctions that have seriously damaged the economy there , a question might be what happens if these issues are addressed favourably for Russia

[ArmChairCivvy]

as a result of the oil price and ...

that is the main thing, only partially down to Saudi intentions (much broader forces working into the same direction)

... and economic sanctions that have seriously damaged the economy there

and the damage will be long lasting as the existing fields are being pumped to the max (in want of new kit and technology) thus making later recovery much less likely.
Also, the Barents Sea agreement with Norway was reached in order to induce Statoil to come and open the fields on the Russian side as well... not happening (but can be done later)

[seaspear]

Another question might be if the lifting of sanctions to favour those who would benefit from trade would be outweighed by increased defense spending to match increased Russian defense spending , Hitler made many promises that were not met with the intention of breaking them why should Putin be trusted on his record ??

[ArmChairCivvy]

Time to check TD's newly created reading list.

One of the ten listed (an Adelphi book dealing with post-Soviet Eurasia) argues that " the crisis has yielded a ruinous outcome, in which all the parties are worse off and international security has deteriorated. This negative-sum scenario resulted from years of zero-sum behaviour on the part of Russia and the West in post-Soviet Eurasia, which the authors rigorously analyse. The rivalry was manageable in the early period after the Cold War, only to become entrenched and bitter a decade later. The upshot has been systematic losses for Russia, the West and the countries caught in between."

Must read it because exactly for those kinds of reasons I wrote the earlier comment to this thread. Not only is post-Soviet Russia a rump as for population, but also a good part of carbon fossile reserves were "partioned" away and the most promising new finds within the territory desperately need Western technology to open them up.

I think we are headed for a thaw, and Putins main goal has been to demonstrate that after the biggest Soviet-kit equipped army outside the nuclear club (Iraq) was taken down in a matter of days (and even Cheznya required a rematch)...
the Russian ability to intervene (and defend) should be taken for real

A v worrying trend in his near-abroad, but on the world scene just seeking recognition. Must say that him having played the very bad hand so well raises questions about political leadership (and strategic analysis) elsewhere.
- a shrinking economy has to be turned around , though